My Love Letter Time Machine - Victorian History

Q&A Bonus Episode (Season 2)

August 21, 2022 Ingrid Birchell Hughes Season 2 Episode 24
My Love Letter Time Machine - Victorian History
Q&A Bonus Episode (Season 2)
Show Notes Transcript

Season 2, episode 24. Q&A Bonus episode. In which Ingrid answers questions from listeners, we find out about Canadian world champion rower Ned Hanlan coming to Middlesbrough to defend his title,  and we get to look at someone else's love letter by way of comparison.

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[Intro]
Hello and welcome back to My Love Letter Time Machine, were we are unfolding the Victorian love story contained in the letters of two ordinary people from Yorkshire — Fred Shepherd and Janie Warburton. I’m Ingrid Birchell Hughes, and I just happen to be their great great grand daughter. Each week we travel 140 years back in time to discover the latest happenings, and while we’ll start Season three next time,  today I have a special bonus question and answer episode for you. 


[Bonus Q&A Season 2, episode 24]

Hello and welcome back - last time we were reading Janie and Fred’s letters in their run up to Fred’s visit for the Easter of 1882, and I used it as a natural break on which to end Season 2 of the podcast. Can’t quite believe it - I started this podcast 7 months ago and I think this will be the 34th episode since I started. 

So while we effectively leave Fred and Janie back in the April of 1882 enjoying their Easter reunion, before we start Season 3, I thought it might be nice to catch up with everyone have another Q&A bonus episode. I asked for questions on social media and got some fascinating ones back, which is brilliant so let’s start:


Christoph from Facebook asks:
Hi Ingrid 
Questions for your podcast 
How long does it take you to record a pod cast and does it all have to be fully scripted or do you formulate free? 
and
What was the biggest plot twist you encountered when reading the letters for the first time and
Do you have a favourite supporting character ?

I pretty much script everything, because I want to being Janie and Fred’s world to life as much as possible. 

One of the things I’ve found with the challenge of telling their story via a podcast instead of the blog is that it has forced me to look at the letters from a fresh perspective. On the blog I could present the research I’d found and let readers make of it what they could. Shen I started doing the podcast I realised that what I was doing was actually enabling Janie and Fred to tell their own story with their own voices in a way, and so my job is to make it as clear as I can.  I like to set the scene where possible to give context to their words so that when you hear me reading the letters out, you get to visualise or empathise as much as possible. 

I don’t do very much deliberate pacing but I will try and tease out the drama if it’s not immediately apparent. And while Fred and Janie share a lot of detail, I have to do a lot of research to provide the background information; for instance in the episode before last, with Janie’s throwaway comment about steel cutlery spoiling the taste of fish - I had to make the decision to either find out why or redact the sentence. I like to keep the letters on here as intact as possible and I will try very hard to clear up the things that don’t quite make sense - I lost an entire afternoon to researching the history of stainless steel with that one single line she’d written. 

On the subject of timing-wise it goes like this, I structure and research the script on a Tuesday, I write it in full on the Wednesday, Thursday is finishing any writing and then doing the recording. Most of the editing gets done on Friday, and it goes live midnight Saturday UK time. I would say most episodes take about 10-14 hours of work, which seems a lot for a 20-30 minute weekly podcast but the bulk of it is spent on the writing and research side. The next longest job is to clean up the voice track because I trip over the lines a lot, or a dog barks outside the window, or something that Fred or more Janie has said sends me into fits of giggles and it takes me a while to get my act together again. The final edit is where I add music and sound effects.

On the question of plot twists and a favourite supporting character, I think the answer to both of these is Janie’s sister Emma and finding out about her story. I wouldn’t say Emma is my favourite in affectionate terms, but she’s the grist in this particular mill I think, particularly in terms of what Janie has to deal with, sorry had to deal with. I know I called this my love letter time machine, but by this point I honestly feel like I spent large chunks of my life back in the 1880s, you know a bit like Tom in Tom’s Midnight Garden.

So I know you’ve heard before in this podcast that I grew up hearing that my mother’s Great Aunt Emma had a sharp tongue on her, that she was a drunk and it was blamed on the fact that she could see the gravestone in the churchyard outside her window. We knew that she would behave so badly that the family would resort to locking her in her bedroom. 

That’s it - that’s all I knew, 

and reading the letters wouldn’t actually tell you very much more outside of Janie’s utter frustration with her.  When I first started researching, one of the things I did, was that I methodically went though my list of names and their hometowns in the newspaper archives for the relevant lifespan dates, just to see what turned up. I got James’ Warburton’s early cricketing exploits and some of Fred’s football matches, I was a bit surprised to discover that Maria Warburton was fined for having a lock-in at the pub around I think in 1905. I absolutely wasn’t expecting to get anything at all for Janie herself so was really surprised to find her quoted in the national newspapers as a witness in the divorce case for her sister. Of course then I wanted to find out why on earth it had ended up in the national papers, and Emma’s husband, John George Herrod, had a sufficiently unusual name that it was easy to find him, suddenly all these stories of him being a jewel thief, abandoning his family and getting a young lass pregnant turned up. I was completely stunned. That was a massive twist for sure.

So here was the answer to all the family weirdness about Emma - I see her as a bit of a tragic figure really but in terms of telling Janie’s story, she’s very much an antagonist.

Helen on Facebook asks
- was there any connection between the poisoning and the suicide? I wasn't sure if it was the same person who had poisoned half the town who then sadly took his own life. I didn't hear you mention the connection explicitly, but I may have missed it.

This is to do with episode 19 where we had a butcher at the centre of a poisoning, and also a butcher at the centre of a suicide within 24 hours of each other.  I can totally understand why you might wonder if there was a connection but no there wasn’t, it was just a rather bad week for the profession in Sheffield. The butcher who made the suspect souse that went on to cause food poisoning was Mr. George Widdison and he was located in Handsworth. The poor chap who took his own life - Joseph Hardcastle, was also a butcher and he came from Darnall. 

Incidentally the suicide was another twist in this story that blew me away when I finally found out about it - which I only did in the week running up to when that particular episode was due to be published.

For years I have had this mystery where the relevant letter of Jane’s is missing and all I’ve had to go on was Fred reflection of the details he must have read. All he mentioned was he was sorry to hear that Maria was so upset about the shooting, wondered why they couldn’t have taken the body to the Crown as it was nearer, and how shocked he was that Janie had looked at the body. 

In a later letter he mentions how sad it was about Joe Hardcastle but said nothing else to connect it so I didn’t know that the shooting was about Joseph, I didn’t know who Joseph was.

So for ages I assumed that some kind of shooting accident had happened in Handsworth and that the body of the man had been brought to the Cross Keys - I have spent so long trying to come up with different searches on the Newspaper archive to see if anything had been reported but nothing came up. As I got closer to scripting this episode I had one last attempt to see if I could come up with anything, and because the archive isn’t complete I decided to just search ‘shooting Sheffield’ and put the search in the national press not just the local. A few things came up and it was when I read the article about Joseph I saw that they had taken his body to the Wellington Inn and the penny dropped. Fred referring to Maria made me think that he was talking about Janie’s mother - when in fact he was talking about her cousin, Aunt Staniforth’s daughter. Fred habitually says ‘your mother’ and never names her - I think as a mark of respect and I was forgetting that. Anyway I couldn’t believe that I’d actually found the answer to this mystery and just in time before I recorded the episode! It was a bit crazy. I was so excited and then of course it really hit, what terrible tragedy to happen and how challenging it must have been to have to deal with it. I was a bit cut up about it actually.

So next we hear from Insta_dan73 on Instagram who is from Handsworth
Hi Ingrid, I just wanted to take the opportunity to say how much I’m enjoying your podcast series. I’m completely hooked and can’t wait for a new episode to arrive each Sunday morning. (Oh what a lovely thing to say, thank you.)

Just one comment I’d like to make as a Handsworth Lad please. Their acquaintance Annie Laverack is mentioned a lot, and I can only assume the Laveracks must have had good standing in the area because they have a road named after them. This is called Laverack Street and next to where we live and was also home to my own grandparents!

So the Laveracks. In the Whites Sheffield District Directory of 1876, you’ll find two listings for the name Laverack on the Handsworth page: John & Thomas Laverack who are listed as Market Gardeners, and Mrs Martha Laverack who I think must have been who Janie refers to as ‘Old Mrs Laverack’. 

In the newspapers, there’s a mention of John & Thomas retiring at the end of the 1890s, and then later a sale of four properties on the first mention of Laverack Street in 1907, the numbers relate to that little row of terrace houses at the Richmond Road end. So my hypothesis (which, I should say, needs further research to back it up) was that John & Thomas Laverack or their family turned to property development. When you looking at 1900 map side by side with a modern map, you can see that the boundary between in their market garden and the land owned by the neighbouring smithy matches up with what became Laverack Street. I bet your grandparents had nice soil in their garden Dan - it would have been tilled for over a century 

Emma [S] Instagram
…I just wanted to say I found your podcast a couple of weeks ago…Got to say I'm loving it, I'm only part way through.
The letters seem so lovely and the fact that they have been kept in your family for 100+ years is amazing and very special indeed.
Some of the letters have made me chuckle, most recent is one where Fred asks why Janie hasn't answered all his question and suggests that she uses his letter as reference and answer each question in turn. I did think what a cheeky devil. I do enjoy her reply though which points put she only didn't answer two of the questions. The lass has fire, I like that.
Again really enjoying the podcast, good luck with everything
Emma

Oh I agree Emma! Thank you - I’m so happy you are enjoying their letters so much. Janie does have fire doesn’t she! I think Fred can be a bit heavy handed at times and I love the way that Janie pushes back. I noticed this again in the last episode where Fred sided with Janie’s mother about how the family should socially treat Mr Walker after it all came to nought with Emma (gosh I’m even talking like them now) and Janie said that Fred was disagreeing with her because she’d not explained it properly in the letter, and was going to update him in person at Easter. I thought that was a v diplomatic approach but I think she was also showing a bit of fire there to as you say. She’s so sweet and largely amenable most of the time, but she’s no push over is she. She reminds a lot of the women in my family - I guess I shouldn’t be surprised should I.

Sparrowsion on twitter asks
An intriguing thing from Jane's 4th April letter … the "boat race" the result of which would have "provoked" the people of Middlesbrough. What on earth was that? Surely not The Boat Race we might assume today?

Ah I did wonder about chasing that detail but I was so focused in getting Season 2 to a tidy close, I didn’t. I wish I had now as the story behind it is rather brilliant and would have delighted all my Canadian listeners. 

So the line in Janie’s letter reads “You would have a great stir in Middlesbrough yesterday on account of the boat race I see that Hanlan has won very easily, at which the Middlesbrough people will be rather provoked.” This is not the Cambridge Oxford University boat race but in fact was a World Sculling Championship that took place on the river Tyne in Middlesbrough on the 3rd of April 1882. 

The defender of the title was Ned Hanlan, a sporting superstar from Toronto, Canada who had first claimed the World Championship title after beating Australian Edward Tickett on the Thames back in 1880. This then opened him up to defending his title from multiple challenges for several years, including on this occasion from the English champion Robert Watson Boyd of Middlesbrough. The prize money was £1000. The Sheffield Independent for the 4th April 1882, which I assume was the account that Janie must have read, describes the ‘great stir in Middlesbrough’ as follows: 

“The morning of the race was ushered in somewhat inauspiciously, the sky being dull and murky. From an early hour the streets presented indications of the excitement generally prevalent a few hours prior to the commencement of a great aquatic struggle on the river. Great as is usually the influx of visitors on the occasion of a great boat race, never before has there been so many people within the borough limits to witness a sculling championship. Long before the time appointed for the race huge crowds began to move from the town westwards, and the competition for vacant space from which even the smallest sight could be obtained was exceedingly keen. The scene in the vicinity of the close was an extremely lively one, whilst before one o'clock the High Level was one black mass, and the swing bridge below was taxed to its fullest extent. Along each side of the river every vacant space was  occupied, whilst the crush in the upper reaches proved that, so far as attendance was concerned, it was the largest that has ever been known at a sculling contest on the Tyne.”

The article goes on to describe the race in breathtaking detail, and apparently Boyd tired towards the end and Hanlan beat him by two and a half lengths. Hanlan left a huge sporting legacy in Canada and there are many statues and monuments commemorating him. A film of his life, The Boy in Blue, was made 1980 staring Nicolas Cage as Halan. 

Yeah really wishing I’d included this in the previous episode now! Oh well we’ve had a little look here.

Next Goudybolditalic twitter says
Just binged a bunch of episodes I'd been saving SO GOOD.

Am I getting this right? The way Janie does her confirmation homework is to send the questions off to Fred and hand in his answers? Does everyone think this is normal? Her? Fred? The minister?

So glad you are enjoying the pod Goudy, thank you. 

I think, in the beginning, Fred offered to give Janie a bit of a hand with her confirmation homework and as time goes on, I think she leans on him more and more with him. Their conversations seem to indicate that as she has lacks some religious knowledge to fall back on, in particular with knowing where on earth to look in the bible to answer those specific questions. Fred appears to have a deeper knowledge and a bit more of a clue where to look. I’m starting to suspect Janie hasn’t had any formal education beyond Sunday school and in part I think her writing confidence may have deserted her, couple that with being pressured for time working in the Cross Keys, I can see why being able to lean on Fred for this made sense. I have no idea if the Rev Mowat had any idea that she was getting Fred’s help, there are no clues within the letters. 

and Goudy also asked
Janie and Fred keep saying how they miss their "special walks". Do we think they mean walks, or skiving off for a bit of heavy petting?

The short answer to this is yes. or both. all of the above. I think they both genuinely enjoyed walking, but they both mention things getting a bit steamy at a particular style somewhere along their route.

Staying on the theme of getting up to things I have this question from 

Gwenfarsgarden on Twitter says
I'm not sure if you'll have an answer to this, but given how much detail about their sex life Fred & Janie go into, in their letters, I wondered how typical this might actually be for the time? Struggling to phrase this well, so let me know if it doesn't make sense.

And in a similar vein emma.lou on Instagram askes

Are there any other surviving letters of courting couples from this era and if so, how does the tone compare to Fred & Janies?

I think you could potentially do an entire degree trying research and answer this question. So much of whats on line regarding letters from the time are from historically famous people. I did find an example of a letter from a collection of over 100, held by the University of Liverpool, written about 10 years earlier by Sir John Tomlinson Brunner, who became a successful business man and politician. He was the son of school master so that would probably make him roughly lower middle class, and benefiting from a good education. So not the same background as Fred but there are similarities in their intellectual ability.

On the website it says: “If you read the letters there’s lots of talk about cricket and work, but the amount of letters shows a deeply strong desire to keep two people a part of each other’s lives. These letters are about 150 years old and so much has changed in the way people, and partners, communicate with each other, so they’re really interesting artefacts”

The letter of Brunner’s they’ve published is one he sent to his then fiancé, (and later wife) Salome ‘Sally’ Davies, and I’ll share it here now by way of comparison. I think there are some similarities in tone although perhaps a little more formal? and I think there’s an oblique reference to intimacy that he glosses over. 

“My dear Sally,

I have your likeness before me tonight so that I can look at you and talk to you almost at the same time.

What a serious face it wears that same likeness, but nobody knows better than I how soon the face of the original can break into a smile, indeed I have almost expected every minute to see a smile on the face in the portrait when I looked at it.

This time last week, lassie I had a chance which however I did not avail myself of, of dreaming of a very pleasant evening spent at Kirkdale, it is very pleasant now to think about it.

The possession of your portrait dear Sally, makes me think of … something we have tacitly agreed not to write about.

The past twelve months have been the happiest, the most rationally happy year of my life, and have taught me more than one thing that will I hope be useful and beneficial to me during the rest of that life.

I have been taught the pleasure of making little sacrifices for the comfort and happiness of others, and I have been taught the danger and folly of relying upon my own strength for the victory over my faults.

How very very far I am yet from completely conquering my faults no one knows so well as I do.

Thinking of you has often and I hope often will again, help me when I want help. Being able to see you almost as I can now will be better still.

I suppose you have been sitting alone [this] evening, as I have – your Mama sitting with Miss Houghton and Harry visiting Mr Smith.

Why did I not press you to pay me a visit here? [?], but you would have wanted to be off again to catch the last train one poor half hour after I came in, and that would have been only tantalising.

Perhaps, as I have often heard that lassie with the earnest face say “It is all for the best, after all, depend upon it John”.

But it is long past bed time, I must bid you good night, and put you [out] of sight and out of mind too, unless you appear in my dreams, till I can see you by day light, and think about without knowing that I ought to be in bed.

I suppose you have not altered your mind about going to chapel with me next Sunday.

And that we are to see Harry and Nell on Saturday Evening.

Please give my love to your Mama and to Nell if you are sending a message to her.

Good night love, may God bless you.
Ever yours
JT Brunner”

So for my last question, Emmalou also asked
Who would play Fred and Janie in a tv adaptation of their story?

Oh wouldn’t that be awesome to have their story dramatised?! I think that would be like winning the lottery! I’m not that up on young actors these days, but I think maybe Asa Butterfield and Emma Mackey, from the Netflix drama Sex Education, look to have something of the intensity and feistiness to play Fred and Janie. But honestly, the only person I really do think about, and this would be to play Janie’s father - James Warburton, is Sean Bean - because I don’t know if you know this - he actually comes from Handsworth, and I know for a fact that he’s had a pint in the Cross Keys pub quite a few times. So I think that would be pretty awesome. By the way, if you want to know what a Handsworth accent sounds like - he’s your guy. 

Well that brings us to the end of the Q&A this time. I stupidly thought I’d have an easier research week this time but you guys put me through my paces - for which I’m kinda grateful! Thank you so much for all your support - it’s wonderful to get your feedback and I’m so happy there’s a devoted community of Fred and Janie fans out there. I’m thrilled you’re enjoying the podcast and I hope you enjoy season three even more!

We’ll leave it there for now.

[outro]
Thank you for listening to My Love Letter Time Machine. 

We’ll be back next time with Season 3 where it looks like Fred might have to find new lodgings. And discover there was a coalminers fight outside the Cross Keys which resulted in the assault of a police officer. 

In the meantime perhaps you could show the podcast some support by clicking on the ratings, leaving a review or sharing it with someone who you think might enjoy it, and if you’d like to write to me, you can at my love letter time machine at gmail dot com.

Until next time, take care.
© Ingrid Birchell Hughes 2022